INFO!!! fairphone DOES SUPPORT CUSTOM ROMS!!!
i like the idea of a fairphone. i dun wana buy one tho - if it doesn hav the features i need/wan.
if fairphone had all dis stuff - it would hav a genuine moat, besides the sustainability stff-
alternative image link (blahaj zone)
Features ‘people’ want? Like being able to easily use the device, have a decent battery life, a good set of apps, built in security and not having to care AT ALL about most of things mentioned in that meme?
I don’t get what’s mentioned either. Fairphone literally partners with Murena /e/OS, other ROMs are also flashable on the device. What “people” want is to buy and be happy though, and their partnership does just that for at least the EU.
The only thing that’s both a fair argument and something I commonly hear from average users is that a 3.5mm audio jack indeed would be nice. By now USB-C to 3.5mm cables with built-in DAC (which also work on any PC, very handy) are available for less than 10€ though, so it’s absolutely more of a “nice to have” thing.
I will never buy another phone without wireless charging. Yes, I know it has significant downsides. I do not care, I am hard on my ports, wireless charging doesn’t break. Given that qi2 is now available as a standard and blunts the severity of the downsides as well … Realistically not buying another phone until I can get an unlocked bootloader qi2 phone with decent specs.
Wireless charging is a waste of energy
A ten minute cold shower vs a ten minute hot shower saves more energy than a month of wireless charging wastes. It is. Not. Significant. We’re talking like 150WH a day wasted being the absolute upper reasonable limit. More likely especially with qi2 we’re talking about maybe 30WH a day wasted. That’s about 3/4 of a teaspoon of gasoline if you’re curious. I don’t own a car for the record though, I bike or ride transit everywhere. Also, I basically don’t ever have to buy replacement charging cables. Somehow I’m not worrying about the energy lost to my wireless charger.
Let’s do the math. Apple sells about about 200 million devices a year. Let’s say they remove the charging port and completely rely on wireless charging, which isn’t completely unrealistic. If we use your 30wh this would result in 6.96GWh or lost energy every single day. With 150wh it would be 34.8GWh.
If that’s not significant for one dumb decision I don’t know what is.
Okay, if we’re going to do the math on typical consumer usage lets talk in less worse case scenario terms, an iphone 16 depending on the model has around a 15 Wh battery, a typical consumer uses lets say 80% of their battery life per day so we’re looking at charging 12 Wh per day, QI2 reports as much as 93% charging efficiency, that seems optimistic though, let’s say 80% average, and let’s also generously say wired is 100% efficient (it’s not but whatever). This makes the math easy, we’re wasting 3 Wh per day to wireless charging vs wired. Across 200 million devices, all concurrently being actively daily used and wirelessly charged we’re looking at 600MWhs. That’s quite a bit, it’s about enough to get a single Boeing 747 3/4ths of the way across the atlantic ocean. Or two private jets a round trip. There are about 1400 transatlantic flights per day on average. This would use about .0007% of the worlds electricity generation.
Let’s not forget that’s devices sold per year. If you replace all iphones, that’s about 3 billion I think. This number looks a lot different.
Comparing this to global energy production is not really helpful, in my opinion.
If people, not only lemmy’s people and a small minority care about the jack people would buy phones with jacks, there are good options but very few people do.
Most people actually like and prefere bluethooth.
Same for ROMs, when was the last time you said “wow, I sure miss custom roms” and the whole room went “meeetooo”. Hell, most people don’t even know what a custom rom is.
This is not what “the people want” is “what lemmy thinks everyone ones, but is actually only them circle jerking”.
Downvote me to hell, but is the truth.
Headphone jacks are less important to me than other features but that doesn’t mean I don’t want one. I have to use a stupid USB to headphone adapter thingy to use my headphones and I cant charge it while I do, which yes, is a thing I wanted to do a few times.
Well i know a lot of people irl who miss the headphone jack and none are lemmy users and not all are nerds
I know a lot of people who don’t, so? Anecdotal information.
We don’t have independant studies in this debate afaik sor anecdotal info is relevant here
Alright. I know no one outside of lemmy who cares about the jack, you do. Where does that leave us?
Well, some people care about it then
i said in the post “to get me interested”, not “to get the majority of people interested”.
It says clearly down to the right “Focus on features people want”.
What I want from fairphone:
- Take security and long-term support seriously
This post really resonates with me and I’ve already said my piece about jack removal and BT buds arriving at the same time by FP.
The realization I came to is that FP is not an enthusiast brand and doesn’t want to be; it is not the Framework of phones.
They cater to the broadest market segment, they want to be the repairable Samsung, rather. And it shows.
Is there any brand that does want to be the Framework of phones?
Xiaomi and OnePlus used to be. Repairability, cheap(er), good specs, reliable. Now Xiaomis are stupidly unreliable and practically not bl-unlockable and OnePlus is starting to block bl unlocking in some regions, they don’t allow avb-yellow and are expensive as shit. Nowy maybe nothing if we ignore the light bullshit.
Used to have a OnePlus Nord. Broke the screen 3 years after the phone released and there were no replacement parts anywhere, besides a single AliExpress seller. It didn’t make things better that they released multiple versions of the same model, most, if not all, had incompatible screens.
The screen protectors for both Nord and 8T were out of stock less than a year after the phones were released, never to be seen again.
They were able to capture various national markets by competing on being favorable to consumer wants, now that they have a strong foothold, or straight up control whole markets, they get to juice their profits.
I’ve recently come across this: https://www.shift.eco/en/shiftphone-8/. Unfortunately also no headphone jack… But when my current phone breaks this might be the phone to get, for me at least.
Damn, the is so sick… except for the missing jack. What a bummer :(
Interesting. Any idea how compatible it would be with US mobile networks? I’m currently using Mint/T-Mobile (not Verizon, which is notoriously incompatible) but every time I’ve found an EU phone that looks appealing in the past compatibility was always a possible concern so I never got any.
I don’t speak German and after some searching I am still not sure. Most of the results are full of speculative/preview type info and focused on performance.
I think I’ve heard them being fully compatible (would be surprised if they weren’t), but I might be wrong.
The missing 3.5mm Headphone jack hurts so much :(
yesyis, also my biggest gripe ;(((
if i cud jus hook up my good lil headponies - like - i wud keep that phone for however long i cud keep it-
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becuz i wana-
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A 3.5mm to USBC converter really does cost less than a coffee… Was probably not made with ethical labour tho
I always see this argument but I really don’t want anything plugged into anything as important as the USB-C port while the phone is in my pocket.
3.5 plugs are rather short outside of the phone (at least for headphones with 90deg plugs) to minimize leverage that you put on the port. Being able to rotate also means less stress on the port as well.
The USB-C adapters are pretty short, but lack the rotation. I have replaced USB-C ports in dozens of Nintendo Switches and other devices, it is pretty clear they aren’t designed to take much stress.
Long story short if anything happens I would much rather have the 3.5mm pin stuck in a headphone jack than breaking the USB-C port and making it so my phone is a brick.
Totally valid. My fairphone USB port broke after a few years. Took a £20 part and ten minutes to fix, but it’s definitely still an issue with USB C.
However, 3.5mm to USB-C adapters are not passive, they’re active. They need a DAC (Digital to Analog Converter) to generate audio signals from the digital data stream that comes from the USB-C.
Phones didn’t use to have very good DACs (with exceptions, of course), but they’re still normally better than whatever you get from a 3€ adapter.
Adapters are also less convenient than a headphone jack, because now you need to remember taking the adapter and the headphones with you.
However, 3.5mm to USB-C adapters are not passive, they’re active. They need a DAC (Digital to Analog Converter) to generate audio signals from the digital data stream that comes from the USB-C.
There are entirely passive adapters, but they’ll only work if the phone has the necessary hardware of course.
USB is digital, TRS is analog. All adapters must have a DAC (digital to analog converter) to make that transition. DAC requires power, making it active. DAC in phone will be higher quality to convert to analog. DAC in cheap adapter will be low quality.
Or, you wire the output of the DAC in the phone up to the USB C port and enable them only when the connected dongle announces it supports “Audio Adapter Accessory Mode” that lets the phone pass the analog audio signal through directly.
It has mostly fallen out of favour though, as it’s become easier to just stick the DAC directly in the headphones (Or speakers etc.) and keep a purely digital output path.
I’d consider that if they added a second USB port, but no. Why would anyone want to use headphones while their phone is plugged in?
I use a dongle and get better audio quality than I ever had on an integrated jack. I really don’t care if a phone has the jack. If I want something compact on the go, I use bluetooth ears. If I want to listen to high quality audio, I use the dongle with a quality DAC with proper headphones.
“focus on feature people want” crowd when you tell them you don’t want a headphone jack: Downvote, your opinion doesn’t matter.
Edit to add on your point: using a DAC or Bluetooth and I have better sound audio than an abused jack that is the first thing to break on my phones. Plus no cable to annoy me and get tangled everywhere.
I understand some people don’t want to move on but they then act like there is such a huge market for it and that everybody should want one. Spoiler: the market says no, if it was a differentiator for sales more phones would have one.Removed by mod
Fairphone has sources available for it and an unlockable bootloader. There are nightly builds of Lineage already available for the FP6
And you can buy it with /e/OS prwinstalled which is a custom degoogled rom of android
postmarketOS also has rudimentary support for the FP6
TLDR - focus on features people want.
You think people don’t want accessories…?
naw- i agree, peeps want accessories. i was just mad that they made the backplate accessorie so that even the basic bavkplate has screws on the back… which triggers somthin evil in me - iduno-
And the removable battery was really awesome. Being able to turn your phone off completely in just 10 seconds without any tools. Or pop in a spare one and have a fully charged phone on the go.
Also maybe I’m paranoid but it’s really nice to know you can turn the phone completely off.
Yeah. This is also my opinion. I don’t trust phones to be completely disconnected when there is no physical switch, just a button that has to be pressed.
The replaceable battery has less and less appeal toe with those crazy 120 watt chargers. A good power bank can replace that functionality quite a bit IMO.
Until your battery needs to be replaced and it costs you $300 for a phone repair shop to.do what should be a 10 second job
Fair.
I hope my battery will last long enough 😰
I don’t care about fast charge times. I do care about my battery life significantly shortening after one year.
My old Xiaomis never had that problem 🤷🏼♀️ guess I was lucky, hoping it’ll continue like that 😁!
I heard iPhones are crap when it comes to battery life and batteries in general, but that’s just what I have heard.
I was speaking to the fact that I cannot replace the battery after one year.
It’s a Lithium Ion problem. There are a limited number of recharge cycles.
On average, after one year of charging every day, your smartphone battery will be at 80% its original capacity.
Yeah maybe 80% is then way more than I need today. Computers are getting more efficient.
But actually it’s not at all 80% after 365 charge cycles, that is just lying. Battery tech is also improving but never had it been 300-400 charging cycles to even 90%
i don’t mean this in a mean way, but I think you forgot how good replacing a battery was and got Stockholm syndromed into liking non replaceable batteries lol
I sure do remember and it was useful because the gps drained the 3000mAh battery like crazy, and using the phone even moderately needed battery nr 2.
Today I don’t need to recharge my phone more than nightly, with the rare being sick and watching 12 hours of YouTube in a row, but then I can charge my phone from 10% to 90% in under 20 minutes sooooooo… WAY less important for me.
And you sure did mean it in a mean way, otherwise you’d just stuck with your opinion instead of trying some low level insult of my mental state.
You’re arguing against replaceable batteries. Your mental state is apparent.
And you attack the person because you have no arguments.
Not sure I get the point of dual Sims when esims are a thing.
ESims (at least on GrapheneOs) require google play services
That’s a pretty good reason, I wasn’t aware. Although looking at the docs it appears you only need it to add the esim not to use the esim so you can install google play install the esim and then remove it again.
If it requires a connection to google play, then that rather defeats the purpose of completely removing google from a device.
Off topic but I really like your style of drawing, it’s cute.
^_^I feel like most of these are at least misleading if not outright false (or maybe I’m misunderstanding them, so please correct me if I do).
- Allow custom ROMs: It does, and there is even a Google-free variant they sell on their store.
- Dual SIM and SD card slot: There may not be dual slots, but there is Dual SIM (one physical, one eSIM), and I’m not sure I’ve ever seen a phone with multiple SD card slots.
- Programmable “moments” button: The button is not programmable per se, but there are different settings to make it do different things.
- No dumb accessories: If you don’t find them useful, don’t buy them?
- Headphone jack: Fair enough, I do miss that one, but the USB-C with an adapter works okay, and I’m still using the same headphones that I’ve used for years.
Headphone jack: Fair enough, I do miss that one, but the USB-C with an adapter works okay, and I’m still using the same headphones that I’ve used for years.
I do this as well, but I would also like to charge the phone while I have my headphones connected to it, and all these additional adapter chains often don’t work very reliable, and are much more cumbersome to deal with.
Dual SIM and SD card slot: There may not be dual slots, but there is Dual SIM (one physical, one eSIM), and I’m not sure I’ve ever seen a phone with multiple SD card slots.
Still, I prefer 2 physical slots. Some phones also have Dual SIM + eSIM, where 2 of them can be active at a time.
My current phone has Dual SIM + SD. I have all three populated, on of them with 9esim adapter. Removable eSIM. Easy to replace, and stores multiple profiles.As for the second thing: https://www.androidheadlines.com/2016/01/hands-on-with-the-saygus-v2-smartphone.html
I currently have four eSIMs on my phone. I would love nothing more than to get rid of the last remaining physical SIM.
Ideally, also get rid of the whole slot to improve water resistance.
I would MUCH rather they focus on optimisation and power efficiency. My work iPhone can easily last two days on a single charge, three if I’m not really using it that much, all the while giving me all the processing power I’d need to run high-quality games on it. No Android phones comes anywhere near this and it grinds my gears.
All I’m saying is: different people, different needs.
I currently have 6 eSIMs, but on a removable eUICC. If the phone breaks, I can immediately put it into another phone and use it. Mine even has STK menu for switching and renaming profiles, so it also works in most dumb phones.
Plus all that is free. In my country, eSIM profile download codes are single use, and you pay for them. Swan is €8, O2 €10, Orange €10, only Telekom does it for free.
But yeah, in my case, that could easily mean having to pay upwards of €60 just to put the fucking SIM cards into another phone.Oh, fun fact, I wanted to try one plan at Orange, but screw it. The physical SIM is free, including shipping to home, but for eSIM they wanted €10.25 (while the plan would be €20/mo), and I don’t have empty slots for them.
Meh, average carrier shenanigans. Ereyesterday I wrote to my carrier about being unable to make phone calls, they replied me to call them to “continue the case” after unsuccessfully (who could have guessed) trying to call me. Bro…
At least somebody probably understood what just happened, so they emailed me.Well, guess your last sentence works.
I currently have 6 eSIMs, but on a removable eUICC.
Are you able to have two of them enabled at the same time, or is there a limit to one, since it treats it like a SIM card?
Plus all that is free. In my country, eSIM profile download codes are single use, and you pay for them. Swan is €8, O2 €10 (…) The physical SIM is free, including shipping to home, but for eSIM they wanted €10.25
Wow, that’s insane!
I wrote to my carrier about being unable to make phone calls, they replied me to call them to “continue the case” after unsuccessfully (who could have guessed) trying to call me. Bro…
Was that LycaMobile?
At least somebody probably understood what just happened, so they emailed me.
Ah, never mind, not Lyca after all. These fuckers close FOUR CASES that I raised after failing to contact me, when I was reporting not being able to take calls.
I currently have 6 eSIMs, but on a removable eUICC.
Are you able to have two of them enabled at the same time, or is there a limit to one, since it treats it like a SIM card?
Yeah, just one at a time.
But maybe it could work on some devices, though I am not sure if with this adapter, since it has that extra STK menu, so it may work differently.
Really, the same eUICC chip that would normally be soldered into a phone can be soldered onto SC contact pads and used like that too: https://xdaforums.com/t/a-tricky-way-to-use-esim-on-cn-in-variant.4609543/
Difference is, this will require root to be used on most devices, since the chip doesn’t explicitly allow the respective apps to manage it.However, there’s some mentions that some devices may actually just recognize it as an eSIM even in settings, which is also mentioned here: https://osmocom.org/projects/pysim/wiki/UE_behavior_with_plastic_eUICC
Rumour is that some UEs will treat such an external eUICC just like an internal one, i.e. their normal LPAd would be able to manage and/or download eSIM profiles to it.
However, there may also be some issues with this. I’ve seen quite a few reports of these cards bricking Samsung devices, requiring a factory reset. And the linked article also mentions persisting issues after using the internal SIM manager on Pixel 4a 5G.
What happens on Samsungs is that they suddenly won’t show an IMEI and they won’t recognize any SIM card.
dual sim slot phones were very common in some markets where you needed to have multiple carriers. It’s a lot less common now that eSIM exists, but before then it was a common thing for the EU version of a phone to have dual sim slots when the NA versions were only single sim.
It still is pretty common, but they typically do hybrid slots, so either a SIM or SD card.
ur right bout the first two… i updated the posts content becuz of it (som hours ago)
but the accessories - see - i like the idea, bzt sadly they opted for a screw-on desgin… which then made the phone have two black screws on the back, in places where ur fingers would be… whivh spawns a big uncomfy feeling in me - so its mostly a personal thing-
but yes, ur points r very valid n i agree.
How did you hold one in your hands?? Is there a fair phone store?
Possibly held a friend’s phone.
Fairphone with graphene os and headphone jack would be awesome.
I want a phone completely untouched by Google. No Google hardware, no upstream Google dependencies at all. Hardware that I control and a more “traditional” flavor of Linux with a mobile-native DE.
I would love to have an immutable easy to upgrade system similar to unblue aurora or bluefin, but based on Postmarket os, but with extra security like SE Linux a proper firewalls flatpak support hardend_memory alloc etc. And also Good container support.
Aswell as a way droid version with a few features of graphene os like per App network toggle aswell as storage and contact scopes Sandboxed Google play etc.
And then with a mix between the Sony Xperia 1 VII and a fairphone 6. Such a phone would be awesome.
On a different note the progress the post market is team is making is really promising who knows maybe Linux on a phone will be daily drivable in a few years.
Maybe you will find this interesting: https://furilabs.com/shop/flx1/
Btw, umidigis with the same CPU sell for ~145€ on AliExpress. This is just extreme.
hopefully that is possible soon. i want it too
Also I like your drawings and art style/visualization.
aww thanksies <3 <3 <3 <3
This is going to get buried, but I’m so glad to see this discussion on our comm!! This is something I’ve tried to bring up among other communities I’m in and it never really gains traction. Almost 100 comments on this is awesome!! Luv y’all very much!
heyhi ~ ~ ~ <3
im also happy this kinda post ig getting traction… i guess i should stick with this much simpler type of post… normally i make them like - suuuuuper colorful which kinda makes them less approachblable… meanwhile this one here looks almost… like advertising…
The design isn’t the reason I like it. I like it because of the issues it relates to and seeing people care about anti-corpo tech. If it was super colorful and chaotic I’d still love it! Keep posting however you want to post Smorty, we love having you 🫂
I straight up refuse to ever buy bt headphones. I never really had a desire to use them, and having them as the only option pisses off some deep part of my soul that hates the power being exerted for such a selfish reason.
I just don’t listen to audio on my phone without playing it through a wireless speaker, or playing it through the built in speaker(in private of course). I honestly don’t miss it, instead finding other ways to pass the time around other people.
hates the power being exerted for such a selfish reason.
I just don’t listen to audio on my phone without playing it through a wireless speaker, or playing it through the built in speaker.
You do realize that playing music on anything but a tiny speaker requires more power than BT+headphones? Even playing it loud in the built-in speakers can be note wasteful than later versions of Bluetooth.
Bluetooth transmission power costs are insignificant. But you don’t need to justify preferring the option to have regular wired earbuds on a phone.
well played
I’ve been forced to resort to them since it seems pin on my power port that handles audio signal has failed.
I hate playing stuff I’m listening to on speakers, even in private, I just always feel like someone else might be around, and I don’t want to annoy them, or even worse, have them judge me. It just makes me uncomfortable.
As a firm believer in wired headphones: you can buy an adapter to plug your 3.5mm in the USB-C. IMO it’s not ideal, but they’re small pieces and you can keep them connected to your headphones at all times, so you don’t even have to think about bringing them with you.
Personally, I made a 3.5mm jack non-negotiable for my phone, which severely limited my options. Next time I’ll probably have to get an adapter… :(
