The study later got retracted due to backlash but the fact that it happened at all if fucking baffling.
Don’t forget this study that instead of studying the causes or cures for endo studied the mental effects of the men in a relationship with someone who has endo.
Conclusion(s): Women with rectovaginal endometriosis were judged to be more attractive than those in the two control groups. Moreover, they had a leaner silhouette, larger breasts, and an earlier coitarche.
Okay but like, this actually does point at a potential cause (as in, why it persists/is so common in the population) of the condition, which is sexual selection.
Came to the comments looking for the missing context.
I sometimes feel their is a coordinated push to get women to percieve medicine as anti-woman, presumably so they are less trusting in modern science so they’re more likely to buy into alternative medicines.
An earlier what?
Edit:
https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/coitarche
If somebody has sex for the first time at 17 years old, and another person has sex for the first time at 20 years old, the person who had it at 17 had(has?) an earlier “coitarche”.
I get the reasoning but is there even that much of a correlation between physical attractiveness and likeliness to reproduce?
Yep - I learned this from House:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Complete_androgen_insensitivity_syndrome (CAIS)
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC3425689/These are genetically male individuals (XY) who have internal un-descended testicles and present completely as a female phenotype because their body is incapable of reacting to testosterone.
Not only that, but they usually present as quite attractive women since they’re flush with estrogen, and tend to have sparse pubic, leg, and arm hair. No uterus either which may be a pro for some guys.
The one about attractiveness is on its face bizarre and gross. There are real problems with the way our society prioritizes (or should I say deprioritizes) womens’ health. But IMO the framing in the linked image is dishonest. It makes it sound like the scientific community finally decided to get around to endometriosis in 2013, and chose to ignore causes and treatments. There are over 55,000 hits on NLM for “endometriosis.” The vast majority of them appear, from a quick perusal, to concern things one would expect, such as treatment, management, risk, and root cause.
And the second study, the one about the effects on male partners? That one seems, idk… fine? Good, even. Endometriosis is incredibly painful, and seeing the person you love in pain can cause distress as well. Partners are usually the closest member of a person’s support network. Doesn’t it sound like maybe there should be some literature on the impacts on partners of people with endometriosis? Like maybe that could be useful? And idk how much this matters but five out of the six credited authors on that paper are women, and presumably they thought this was a worthwhile avenue of research.
I have no issues with doing research studies about the mental health of people in close proximity of pain.
My issue with it is mostly due to the lack of research on the people actually in pain. That study is good but it feels backhanded when the women with endo themselves are being left out of a lot of that study funding.
My issue with it is mostly due to the lack of research
Did you stop reading that comment halfway through?
There are over 55,000 hits on NLM for “endometriosis.” The vast majority of them appear, from a quick perusal, to concern things one would expect, such as treatment, management, risk, and root cause
This IS being researched. What are you complaining about? That not 100% of the money goes directly into figuring out root causes and cures but instead some of it also goes into researching social, cultural, and genetic predispositions towards it’s persistence?
Fun times that my friend had it so bad she was in bed for a couple of days in pain with her periods and this is what we get instead of studying a cure.
Fucking assholes
I’ve watched my best friend with this go from getting told “We can’t do a hysterectomy, you might want to have kids!” (despite protests to the contrary) to “well, we can’t be sure you have it without invasive surgery” to “you’re almost menopause age, it’ll go away then”.
I’m furious for her, it’s been tough to watch at times.
You’re watching Healthcare for Women, after the break, a special feature on “your chronic pain and fatigue isn’t real”.
I can add one to that… My partner has it. Like 100% without a doubt has it. Surgically confirmed, when she had her tubes removed. They said there was so much endo that they couldn’t even remove all of it without a blood transfusion. Again, she cannot get pregnant without donated eggs and in vitro fertilization, because she has no fallopian tubes at all.
They’ve refused to do a full hysterectomy, because “but you might want to do in vitro later…”
Im confused. Can you not just tell them to do it anyways? How can they refuse?
I don’t know how you get them to do what you’re asking but they can refuse by simply saying no. And if you are insufficiently servile in accepting that they will find ways of punishing you.
“How do we find a doctor who will cooperate?” is a great way to find out what kind of secret things doctors and hospitals can do to fuck up your life for threatening to go around them or hurting their feelings.
Reading all the comments in this whole goddamn post infuriates me to no end. I have an elderly friend with bipolar who got chewed up and spit out by the legal/medical system because she wasn’t the most cooperative and they basically did things like put her on a heavy dose of haldol which turned her into a zombie to make her more cooperative and fuck with her heart meds almost like they were trying to give her heart attack. It’s part of the reason I hate doctors.
Hating doctors for the state of healthcare is like hating fast food workers for the state of the fast food industry. Very few of them are actual owners and every franchise is a front for some rent extraction by an inheritor leech. Any remaining quality just means the owner class didn’t extract enough value from it.
Your comparison is stupid. Fast food workers have almost no power over the people they serve. Doctors have an immense amount of power to fuck up your life especially if you’re legally required to do what they say. Not an insignificant number will do so if you hurt their feelings. All you need to do is read some of the comments on this post to be informed of that. It’s a problem with the system and a number of individuals with power in the system. I hate doctors because I can never know beforehand if one that I’m seeing is such an individual.
Curious is this was in progressive state or not. Or was it another country altogether.
I’m guessing these are USian posters, but you’d perhaps be surprised at the shit that EU doctors spout, too. One does not simply ‘get healthcare’, especially as a woman.
Misogyny is still alive and well in spite of the times.
*especially because of the times
sadly
And I’m still denied my requests to “just rip out my uterus I’m not using it dear lord please” despite being with the same guy for 20 years. Hhhh
Because one day you’ll realize that bearing children is your only real purpose and then you’ll be thankful to all those men who knew better than you!
/sIt’s not always male gynos. It’s often female ones as well :<
That makes me really, really sad. My partner presents with symptomology consistent with endometriosis and wants to get it investigated but has had shitty luck with male doctors so is now specifically seeking a female doctor, and the thought that she might have to deal with the same condescending and paternalistic shit makes me quite angry.
I’m sorry I’m advance! It sucks! I hope your partner finds a good one! I’m limited by my insurance so maybe they’ll have more luck!
I’ve got a friend with Endo and this is the exact same thing the doctors told her. Same sitch as well - She or her Partner don’t want kids.
“Well, you might change your mind one day” is the kinda responses she always used to get
Maybe after my 20th wedding anniversary they’ll consider it. Briefly. Before changing to “but you’re so close to menopause now, just wait!”
Rrrrraaaage
Being with the same guy for a while would probably not have an impact on fertility, to be fair. Just plain weird that they would mention that as a factor.
Because it’s often mentioned I’ll find someone who will want them
But I’ve been with the same guy who also doesn’t so just take out the uterus eeeee
Sometimes it’s “what if you find a new guy who wants them” which is insulting. Like I’d dump this one or something
My wife was trying to get her tubes tied for years. The doctors said the same thing. It went from “what about your husband? What if you changed your mind in the future? What if you meet someone else and he was the man of your dreams and wanted kids? Does your husband abuse you?”
That last one was thrown in because apparently partners in abusive relationships don’t necessarily want to have kids with their abuser.
Different doctors all asking about the same questions untill she was able to find a doctor that gave her a tubal. So yay for that.
what if you find a new guy who wants them
Ah yes, you don’t have a say in whether you want children.
If a guy wants kids then he’s not the guy for me! But no, clearly I’ll change everything to get a guy!
Yes
I knew as a teenager that periods are worse for some women than for others, but only about a year ago, I got to know a woman - with endometriosis - who regularly passes out from the pain, even after taking pain meds. I feel just so, so sorry for her.
If I were head of the WHO, I would make eradicating this dreadful disease a priority on day 1.I have no love for the attractiveness crew of “researchers”, it is in my eyes lazy work that is actionably useless.
But I do want to stunt on that paper; kings couldn’t even shit out a conclusion? They just discuss then ditch? They end with a paragraph of gibberish then just roll references? These are true clowns
And no abstract, just a shittier intro with no substance? Prob no substance because this line of research is worthless, but still they didn’t even try to fluff it up.
Abs embarrassing to write that shit in 2013 and not have the wherewithal to pen an abstract, conclusion, competent intro, or a line of research that isn’t devoid of value to humanity.
2013 being blissfully free of GenAI, not covering the feckless’ work ethic.
I considered posting this to !mildlyinfuriating@lemmy.world instead but im far more than mildly pissed about this whole thing.
We need a community like hotlyinfuriating, fuckinginfuriating or just infuriating.
I wonder what was the trigger for that…
Like: “Look at those women for the medical trial! They are all straight 10s, we have to get to the bottom of this!” or “My ex got this and she was ugly as hell. I wonder if that is the reason”
I think the meme explains it just fine, that it’s more that the people doing the research and funding the research are simply more interested in that topic, for some reason, than in helping women.
As in the trigger is simply their base level objectification of women and didn’t need an inciting incident. If there was some trigger it’d be boring shit like them reading that the condition correlates with breast size or whatever.
You’d be surprised what the male dominated “academic sphere” will fund and research.
I am most certainly not surprised.
“I don’t want to live on this planet anymore”
I know exactly one person with endo
She’s pretty hot
Even does modelling
Conclusions of the study:
“Women with rectovaginal endometriosis were judged to be more attractive than those in the two control groups. Moreover, they had a leaner silhouette, larger breasts, and an earlier coitarche.”.
Coitarche was a new word for me.
It leaves room for terms like coitarche nemesis
“I applied for this grant as a joke, but they actually accepted it. Now I have to work with these creeps. How the fuck do I scientifically evaluate ‘attractiveness’?”
