I remember typing random combinations of letters and numbers into the hex color field on my marquee span text on my Geocities site when i was a kid and marveling at how it always seemed to yield a different result.
Anyway, as an edgelord 8 year old with unsupervised access to the internet I discovered that my hexcode is #DEATH or some shit like that, I honestly don’t remember what it was but I was fascinated with the color it produced at the time.
It goes against the spirit of the post, but there was a very detailed system for converting invalid colors to valid ones!
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If it exactly matches a recognized named color, use that color.
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If it is a valid three-digit legacy hex form such as
#abc, expand each digit:- a → aa
- b → bb
- c → cc
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Replace non-BMP characters with
00. -
Truncate the value to 128 characters.
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Remove a leading
#, if present. -
Replace every character that is not an ASCII hex digit with
0. -
Append
0s until the length is a multiple of three. -
Split the result into three equal components for red, green, and blue.
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If each component is longer than eight characters, keep only its last eight characters.
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Remove leading zeroes from all three components while they remain longer than two characters.
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If they are still longer than two characters, truncate each to two characters.
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Interpret the three components as hexadecimal numbers and use them as RGB values.
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Somehow this comic made neopronouns make sense to me.
Like I always abided but I never really understood until this punk ass motherfucker kicked through the door and said “Fuck your bullshit, I’m doing what I want.”
My brain always went towards the why and so this helped me stop thinking and just realize hey that’s how they feel best represented and makes them feel good, power to them. Sometimes it ain’t all that deep.
My hex color is #b0bca7, it’s mostly greyscale but nooooot quite. Also it’s spicey and nerdy and fun.
I am really enjoying these, thank you.
Gendered pronouns are dumb, and by extention so are neopronounts. Language is about mutual intelligibility so making a new nondescriptive word for every possible form of gender identity is an exercise in futility. I’m so glad I live somewhere where gendered pronouns aren’t a thing. English should just switch to they/them for everyone and be done with it.
While gender-neutral languages are awesome, the fact that we are speaking a gendered language means we are often communicating gender. Having to communicate gender is the cost of speaking English.
If you refuse to use a trans person’s neopronouns, you will be intelligible as denying their gender. If you internally respect them, but externally misgender them or complain about their pronouns, then your internal intentions are unintelligible. Language is a two-way street. You have a responsibility to make yourself understood, by using the pronouns that match your intentions.
Also, consider that a neopronoun may be perfectly intelligible to everyone as-is. You certainly understand the meaning of Legend’s hex code, #LEG3ND, right? It’s intelligible. When it comes to neopronouns like Legend’s, I think you may be mistaken.; this might not be about intelligibility. In Legend’s case, at least, you understand neopronouns perfectly well. You simply disagree.
English has a gender neutral third person singular pronoun. Calling someone a they/them isn’t denying their gender. There is no reason not to use they/them. Gender isn’t built into the language like it is in some even weirder languages (A chair doesn’t have a gender in English).
I understand it perfectly well, but yes, I do disagree. Not about their gender identity, but about how pronouns work. The way I see it, the whole point with pronouns is to use a widely applicable shorthand to refer to something or someone. If everyone wants to be unique and have their own pronouns, then we might as well not use any pronouns and just refer to everybody by their name.
Edit: Oh yeah and as gendered pronouns are an attempt to communicate gender, then no, I have very little idea what sort of gender the pronoun “legend” is supposed to communicate. I understand the word but not what it means in this context.
When you have the choice to do something, and you don’t do that thing, you’re communicating that you don’t want to do that thing.
When you have the choice to gender someone correctly, and you don’t gender them, you’re communicating that you don’t want to gender them.
This is called de-gendering and many people will take your willful refusal to do the kind thing as a form of relative cruelty. Because kindness and cruelty are relative.
Also pronouns are usually shorter than names, so using neopronouns saves time over names.
I am bad at remembering names. Remembering a set of pronouns is at least as hard as remembering a name. Pronouns help when I can’t remember names. Having to remember custom pronouns defeats the purpose of pronouns.
All that being said, I’ve never met someone IRL who hasn’t picked one of the three most common pronouns sets (he, her, or they), so I see this as largely hypothetical. The internet does tend to be a space for people to test their more extreme beliefs.
I would argue that using they/them is gendering someone correctly. They are gender-agnostic pronouns and can refer to any gender, combination of genders, or lack thereof. They are only potentially insulting in that they are less specific-- which is the entire point of a pronoun. I think if it’s clear from other interactions that you accept someone’s gender identity, it’s pretty dumb to be criticized for not being as specific as someone would want you to be when using a term that’s supposed to be general.
You would argue it, be right on a technicality the same way a bigot can refer to a binary trans person as them to communicate their refusal to accept their identity.
You can talk all you want about why you do something but if I consistently hear my preferred pronouns being used by you I’m left to make an assumption about your character.
Addendum: Of course, you could easily say that the purpose of a pronoun is also to denote gender, and that refusing to do so by being more vague is an insult; but I don’t think it’s a good direction to take the language to make gender more embedded in our language. Specifying gender should be optional for when it is necessary, not an obligation to be made whenever you refer to someone. They are more than just their gender identity, and needing to refer to it whenever you refer to them (other than by name) is counterproductive to maintaining that separation, and is also semantically simpler.
Yeah no, I don’t want to have to juggle as many pronouns as there are gender identities, because gender is a spectrum and that would result in almost as many pronouns as there are people. Remembering peoples names is bad enough for me already. I don’t want to gender anyone unless it’s actually relevant to the discussion. It adds unnecessary complexity and increases the probability of accidentally misgendering people drastically. IMO people should be free to express themselves, but in ways that don’t require others to actively participate in that expression. You know, clothes and stuff that can actually achieve the kind of variety that gender expression necessitates. Profile pictures, usernames, banner images and profile bios online.
I do sympathize with people trying to break the mold of cishet normative gendered pronouns, but long term I think neopronouns are not a scalable solution and doesn’t affect the underlying problem of gendered language (unless one adopts the accelerationist position that people will make so many gendered pronouns that the concept looses meaning that way, but that might be a long shot).
I have the precise opposite opinion, I think society needs to take more responsibility for how we gender others, and not just in language.
We have some ability to control our perceptions. That ability can be trained, and we can learn techniques to do it better. So there’s no excuse for perceiving a trans woman as “non-passing”. The passing is a thing happening inside everyone else’s brain, not in her body! So we need to take responsibility for our own minds and perceive her as female-presenting. And if we can’t, that’s a harmful skill issue we need to fix.
Pronouns are one of the techniques we can use to hack our perceptions. We can use language to manipulate our minds. That’s why neopronouns were invented. That’s the benefit of them.
Apologies on the ninja edits on my previous comment (the latter paragraph is new).
Gender isn’t biological, so the passing is not happening in their body anyways. Gender is social. If they present themselves as female, then sure, they’re female presenting. If someone presents themselves as something more bespoke, then they do just that. Usually it’s just a vibe to me. I don’t see why it would need to be anything more than that, or why I should change the words I use to refer to them.
Though at the same time I concede that it’s probably different for people who have always been changing the way they speak depending on the gender of the person being referred to, and I suppose you’re right in that neopronouns have a use in shaking up that framework. Still, I maintain that in the long term ungendered language would be preferable.
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Well, no. In the context of gendered pronouns being available and the norm of the language, intentionally using they/them instead of someone’s identified pronouns is a disrespect. You are not bending the whole of the most widely-spoken language on Earth by yourself and even if you could, starting with the effective erasure of minority gender identity would be terrible form.
You are not bending the whole of the most widely-spoken language on Earth by yourself
Are you of the belief that singular “they” is not historically common?
It is historically common. We’re talking about using they/them when pronouns other than they/them are requested.
Isn’t it even more audacious to think that everyone should start referring to every queer person by their custom pronouns? Neopronouns are already an attempt to bend the language, and I’m just saying that it’s bending that language in the exact wrong direction because it doesn’t address the root cause of the problem, instead just building on top of that.
No language is being bent, in 99.9% of cases the pronouns being used have always existed in English, the remaining 0.1% are the ‘custom pronouns’ you’re thinking of and are an edge case that is effectively a non-issue to accommodate. I have a queer friend group and live in an extremely queer-friendly city and I literally know just one person who prefers a non-standard pronoun and am happy to accommodate that.
No language is being bent
Well that’s disappointing.
Though I’m pretty queer, I somewhat agree? If I could, I’d go back in time and change first names to demarcate gender identity in a consistent way so we could just use they/them, as you say.
That said, none of us can go back in time, and though we may have the same goal, a goal is not a plan. I’ve yet to see a better method than neopronouns of forcing people (who would usually rather not) to think about gender in new ways, and thus allow people to present how they wish under our language restricted social context.
Think of it like tossing in an outlier to more effectively pull the average somewhere. Every xey/xem pulls us closer as a society to giving a shit about this, and that’s the first step to making progress. Even if it seems to be pissing. A buncha people off in the process
Why would we need first names to demarcate gender identity in a consistent way in order to use they/them for everyone? In my native language we have some names that are more ambivalent about gender than others and we’re doing just fine with a single genderless third person singular pronoun.
I suspect that a lot of cis people would be pissed about being referred to as they/them as well, but they can suck it up. I said this in a different comment here, but I can see that being useful with people who are stuck on that he/she framework. But I still think of this as an unnecessary one step back to take two steps forward, when it could just be taking one step forward.
Is it not just as audacious to expect everyone to fit themselves to the pronouns you want to use? How would you feel about others arbitrarily deciding to use a different pronoun for you?
My whole point here has been that pronouns should have nothing to do with gender, so somebody using a different pronoun to refer to me would not affect me beyond mild annoyance at somebody lying about me by spreading information about my gender if the gendered pronoun isn’t the right one. On the other hand a pronoun that doesn’t carry information about gender can’t misgender a person.
Speaking of hex, reminds me of this one cryptobro, forgot his name, who was on Twitter (as they often are). Had a user name. And in the real name field, “0xusername”. 🤦🏻♀️ That’s not how crypto addresses work, that’s definitely not how hexadecimals work.
I think #00FF00 is one of the few primary hexcodes you can encode in a JPEG with the YCbCr (default) colorspace because it lines up with a corner of it. I tried perfect red and blue but there are rounding errors. Higher bit depth or different gamut might help
I understand this is an allegory for pronouns/gender but I’m also dumb, is green supposed to be nonbinary? or are they being encouraged to use neopronouns they don’t actually want? Pls dumb down for me
Green is binary trans and is being told to use they/she instead of she/her because the cis people don’t actually accept her as a woman. Legend is nonbinary and uses neopronouns.
Gurann Lagan reboot is looking hella tight
Do people outside the U.S. really do pronoun circles? I’m trying to understand what the point of them is.
When you are talking to people the pronouns are always you/yours. When talking about people…. Well don’t talk about people if you don’t know them.
Heavens no, absolutely not. Maybe in a meeting where everyone is introducing themselves, people might be asked to say their preferred pronouns with the rest of their introduction. Like hi my name is infinitesunrise, I’m the facility’s sex technician, I hail from west bumblefuck and my pronouns are he/him. In my free time I grow weed, play with my cat, and draw smut.
I’m in the US and I’ve never encountered this. Some people put them in their email signatures which is fine and has actually been useful a couple times with names that were unclear to me. Mostly we’re just trying to get the meeting over as fast as possible so we can get back to doing actual work. If someone did do this I’d never show up to their meeting on time again, same as I do for people I know are doing icebreakers.
Some people put them in their email signatures which is fine and has actually been useful a couple times with names that were unclear to me.
This is me. I’m a cis man, he/him, but I have a gender neutral name. For some reason everyone in email has always assumed that I’m a woman. So when pronoun discourse started being more common, I was like great, awesome, and started putting he/him in my email signature. Solved that problem. Now everyone thinks I’m a trans man, because “why would a cis person put pronouns in their email signature?” Progress!!
That’s all it takes to be an ally most days. Thanks for that 😊👍
Common in my circles any time you are also sharing names in a circle
in the little place in europe i live in, it is very common for political and queer groups as part of name rounds. the reason for it is the same as for the name round: so you know how to refer to the people in the round.
it’s not just done the first time but at the start of every meeting, so people got a nice chance to update everyone smoothly about name or pronoun changes without having to like do some big comming out. it’s really nice
it’s not common outside those spaces but mainly cause it’s a more new thing and society is really cis binary normative so most people just expect to be able to guess everyones pronouns correctly (they are not)
I’ve never encountered such a thing in the US. Closest might be name tags with space for pronouns on them.
Actually, My second person pronouns are You/Yours, with a capital letter.
Yes, officer! That’s Yours, over there! You’s the one that did! You was all by Yourself in that corner!
That’s… Not how second person works, grammatically speaking. “Officer” would be the addressee, so you should be using third person pronouns to refer to “the one that did”
no, me do pronoun grammer gooder
My third person pronouns are She/They/It, with a capital letter.
You’s on first
You’re the second person to have said that.
They’re the third-person now
They did them in my LGBT+ youth group in the UK
Also, to answer your question, people do use pronoun circles. Every adult should be experienced enough to change their perception of other people’s gender at will, so pronoun circles are a chance to make sure you’re perceiving other people correctly.
Isn’t it an incredibly hostile experience, a bunch of strangers looking at you, expecting you to perform your pronoun dance for them?
It doesn’t seem… welcoming.Maybe I’m way off base here, but every version I can imagine seems like true nightmare fuel, at least to my introverted ass.
This comic is deliberately emphasising the bad parts of pronouns circles as an example of what not to do. You’re not supposed to interrogate people or debate with them about their pronouns. Decent people don’t act that way.
But there are problems with them that trans people have pointed out. Like, if you’re closeted, then you have to choose between outing or misgendering yourself. That’s what’s happening to Blue, who’s not ready to come out yet.
We don’t necessarily have a great solution for that one. The best we can do is make it optional to give your pronouns. But then closeted people who don’t give their pronouns can be perceived as transphobic chuds.
Like, if you’re closeted, then you have to choose between outing or misgendering yourself.
Isn’t that always true? Even if you remain silent on the matter, other people will then have to ask for your pronouns or possibly misgender you by assuming them.
Pain carries more weight when it’s caused by self harm than when it’s caused by other harm. And it carries more weight when it’s deliberate than when it’s accidental. So, accidentally being misgendered by someone else feels better than deliberately misgendering yourself.
Interesting
usually its a social situation where a bunch of strangers are interacting for the first time so most people dont know each other yet. you give your name, you give your pronouns, maybe you say another thing about yourself prompted by whoever organized the event. its a way to introduce everyone quickly and it happens in a lot of different situations. but yeah its kind of uncomfortable if youre introverted or have social anxiety.
Giving your pronouns along with your name (and any other additional information) as part of a normal introduction isn’t what’s depicted in the comic’s pronoun-circle though. We see everyone just sit down to shout out (and start to argue about) just their hex-codes/pronouns.
Also, I have a hard time interpreting the arguments of #LEG3ND. #LEG3ND points to the visually green appearance of the other figure in defense of their self-identification of a less-matching green hex-code, and opposing the suggestion of the closer-matching hex-code. I would normally understand that interpreting someone’s external appearance instead of just trusting their stated pronouns or gender would be a bad thing, but here #LEG3ND’s (seemingly inaccurate?) interpretation of appearance is given as the more favorable supporting point? The comic seems to use non-primary colors as an analogy for untraditional/neo pronouns or non-binary genders/identities. But then #LEG3ND unapologetically gives a “hex-code” that is not only outside the range of primary colors (or something like standard named html colors), but actually incompatible with the format of hex codes entirely, and refuses to clarify at all, which seems equivalent to something like responding with a set of pronouns that is not usable in standard English (eg a list of 5). So then is the comic then, through its protagonist, deriding the answering with intelligible pronouns at all? Given context, that doesn’t seem the intended effect, but understanding what the author actually intended to convey about real-world pronouns or genders without substantially assuming their analogies seems impossible unless there’s some cultural references I’m missing.
Green identifies as green, and looks green, and gave everyone a green hex code. The correct thing to do would have been to accept that Green is green. Instead, one of the greyscales suggested that Green use a less saturated hexcode, and tried to frame it as inclusivity.
This is the equivalent of hearing a trans woman say she uses she/her and telling her to use they/she. They’re saying “You don’t have to be binary, we’re accepting” to a person who is binary, and wants to be accepted as binary.
Legend saw all this go down, and concluded that the greyscales in this group are assholes. Legend doesn’t believe in letting the laws of computer science decide their identity for them. And when the greyscales start telling them to let the laws of computer science decide their identity for them, they decide not to take the bait. They’re not going to argue about the validity of their identity, because these assholes aren’t worth that effort. They’re never going to accept Legend, so it’s pointless to try and explain.
The rules of grammar, like the rules of computer science, were made up by people. They can be changed by people. My pronouns break the rules of English grammar, and I don’t care. I’m like Legend.
so the grayscale assholes in this comic are nonbinary they/them people who in some nonbinary normativity insist that everyone wants to use they/them pronouns, no binary pronouns, no neo-pronouns?
im not gonna say that this couldnt happen but this seems like a very unusual scenario to me, even if it were a specifically nonbinar group meeting. it seems so far removed from any experience i had
In this world, gender isn’t about body shape and pronouns. It’s about colours and hex codes. The dipshits are cischromatic greyscales. Green, Blue, and Legend are transchromatic. Green is an out primary colour. Blue is a closeted primary colour. Legend is an out teriary neohex-using colour.
Think of greyscales as cis, primaries as binary trans, secondaries as nonbinary androgynous, tertiaries as nonbinary xenogender, hex codes as pronouns, and impossible hexes as neopronouns, especially neogrammatical pronouns.
Also, it’s not relevant to this particular comic, but Unwanted Purple Syndrome is an intersex condition.
Thank you, that explanation helps me a lot. I certainly agree with that core point.
